Author Topic: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run  (Read 21042 times)

Snerf

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Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2005, 02:58:43 PM »
Well, that was strange.
So, in an experiment , I tried Ice7 on an XP SP1 pc, and wouldn't you know, I had the same problem. So, I thought I would try running the EXE on its own, without the other files, and it worked. So, i tried deleting some of the files in the folder, and with the 1st one, icechat7.exe.manifest, once it was deleted, IceChat 7 ran. So, that file is the culprit.
What that file is for, is to get XP looking controls in IceChat. I will look into a different solution for this, but in the mean time, for anyone else reading, delete that file, and it all looks good from there.

Stranger things have happened.  :)
The IceChat God

mr-b

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Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2005, 04:03:03 PM »
Thanks for the sanity check!  :)

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2006, 06:28:58 AM »
I am running Windows XP Professional SP2 and the same kind of a problem happens here as well.

When I run IceChat 7, a new process appears in task manager and then disappears. No messages are shown, program just closes without even displaying its window (or splash screen). I do have folder "%User_Profile%\Application Data\Icechat" and it has subfolder "Logs" but no files are there.

Also, FirstRun.exe runs ok, so does Profiles.exe. Updater.exe gets closed by DEP. It is a fresh install.

I also tried IceChat5, which got closed by DEP.

I have been using IceChat on an other computer (with Windows XP Professional SP2 with DEP turned on for everything)  without problems (however, there I had it installed long ago and updates have not broken anything).

Both PC-s are quite clean, however, there are differences. Let PC1 be the one where IceChat does not run and PC2 be the one where it does run. Then:
PC1 is running Kapersky Personal Antivirus, PC2 is running Avast! Personal Antivirus
PC1 is running Windows Firewall, PC2 is running Kerio Firewall
PC1 is running Nero (and incd), PC2 isn't
PC2 is being used for .NET and Windows developement, so it has most of the debug and developement libraries installed, PC1 does not have Windows or .NET developement environment

I couldn't find any other significant differences between those two PC-s.
Running IceChat as Administrator makes no difference.

Manifest files are only required by Windows XP or newer and are there to mark dependencies. As SP1 users probably had an old version of Windows Common Controls library, which caused the program to quit (older Windows versions ignore manifest file).

Snerf

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #18 on: May 23, 2006, 08:07:28 AM »
Have you tried deleting/moving the manifest files?
Also, I am not sure what you mean by "DEP".
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Morio

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2006, 09:32:03 AM »
probably this:

"Data Execution Prevention (abbreviated DEP) is a feature included in modern Microsoft Windows operating systems that is intended to prevent an application or service from executing code from a non-executable memory region."
"I don't know what World War 3 will be fought with, but I know World War 4 with be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein

ReD-HaMMeR

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #20 on: May 23, 2006, 11:15:30 AM »
Hello, I have XP Pro SP1, and every version of icechat7 worked perfectly on my computer

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2006, 02:29:31 AM »
Have you tried deleting/moving the manifest files?
Also, I am not sure what you mean by "DEP".


Yes, I tried moving manifest file, but it did not help. I also verified that my Common Controls library is newer than required by the manifest.

And by DEP I do mean Data Execution Prevention (as Morio already suggested). You can chance its settings at Contol Panel -> System -> Advanced -> Perfomance -> Data Execution Prevention.

Snerf

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2006, 09:46:56 AM »
Ok, well, I basically know nothing about DEP settings, but turning it on, on my own machine made no difference in anything, IceChat still ran.
So now it is a matter of shooting in the dark, and seeing where the program is dieing.
You wrote that no files were created, in the Application Data\IceChat folder, just the folders themselves. That does tell me that some code is being processed.  The main file that I look for is a startup.txt file in that IceChat folder, but if that is not being created, I am talking a guess that it is dieing where it is trying to setup the DDE for IceChat, which is one of the first things it when it loads. It adds a couple of settings to the Registry here, and the only place that it does.
So for the next Beta Build, or an intermediate build for you to try, I will add an option to disable DDE, and then we can see if it helps any.
The Registry settings are placed in HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\irc , if you want to see if they are added or not. If they are not, then my hunch is, thats where IceChat is choking.
The IceChat God

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2006, 02:42:30 PM »
As I said, I am using IceChat on another computer with Windows XP Professional SP2 (and DEP turned on for everything) without any problems. So it is not a surprise that you could not reproduce the problem by modifying settings (DEP is only relevant about updater being closed by DEP).

However, you mentioned DDE, which could be the actual cause of the problem. I shall have a look at my DDE settings and the registy keys on monday as I get to the problematic computer again :).

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2006, 03:13:03 AM »
I had a look at my DDE configuration. I even started (previously disabled) NetDDE service. It did not help.

Also, IceChat 5 did create HKCR/irc registry keys, IceChat 7 did not. I hope, this information is useful :).

Snerf

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #25 on: May 29, 2006, 07:46:14 AM »
Ok, thats what I suspected then.  Will know for sure when the next build comes out. You could get a temporary build if you come to #icechat support channel on Quakenet, and you happen to catch me there. Or just wait for the next public release.

Thanks
The IceChat God

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Beta 20060627 won't run
« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2006, 01:18:55 AM »
I installed the latest beta release (20060627 ) and run it. It does not quit by itself, but it does behave the same as IceChat 5: "To help protect your computer, Windows has closed this program." ("Data Execution Prevention - Microsoft Windows" dialog). Any safe solutions for that?

 No log files appear. Crash follows DEP message. Following event log message gets created:
Source: Application Error
Category: (100)
Type: Error
Event ID: 1000
User: N/A

Faulting application IceChat7.exe, version 7.0.0.0, faulting module unknown, version 0.0.0.0, fault address 0x0016d220.

Microsoft article about DEP: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/maintain/sp2mempr.mspx.
I believe IceChat has some issues with Physical Address Extension (PAE) as this seems to be the only relevant difference between my computers. Maybe others can confirm that. You can see wether PAE is available at Control Panel -> System dialog just below CPU and memory information (in my case Intel Pentium 4 2.66 GHz). Information about fixing applications to work with DEP (and PAE) is inluded in the referenced article. Additionally, In Boot.ini I have /noexecute=OptOut.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2006, 02:41:42 AM by siim04 »

Snerf

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #27 on: July 05, 2006, 11:44:39 AM »
Well, this may just be out of my expertise area, but I may be able to try and compile IceChat7 with some different options, to see if that helps at all. Then you could try these builds, and see if any changes have occured.
Best way to do this is to try and find me on the #icechat support channel, and talk directly to me.
Other then that, my hands are kind of tied, as this does seem to be a rare problem, and only with people that would use those options you have, which doesn't seem to be very common.
The IceChat God

siim04

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #28 on: July 05, 2006, 01:27:26 PM »
It will probably be more of a problem when hardware DEP gets more popular (that would be when Vista comes out I guess). The basic idea is that you are executing code from your applications memory data area. To solve the problem, the memory has to be requested with execute permissions. Depending on the complexity of IceChat, the fix could be difficult to produce.

Meeting on irc channel has the drawback that IceChat does not work on the computer where I have problems. I tried using HydraIrc (works fine but has many components disturbing normal use and is missing the usability of IceChat), but it seemd that we live in (quite) different time zones   :-(.

Snerf

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Re: Icechat 7 Alpha 041505 won't run
« Reply #29 on: July 05, 2006, 01:35:42 PM »
Well, then if you do not wish to try and fix/address the problem by meeting in #icechat, then I guess IceChat is not the program for you. As I can not reproduce the problem myself, I need help in fixing it. If that help is not made easily available to myself, I don't worry about it, and move on. 

IceChat is made with an older language, that really won't be very compatable with Vista most likely anyways, but that does not bother me in the slightest way anyways, because people always come up with solutions to fix things.

Yes, IceChat 8 could be re-coded in the new .Net 2.0 language, but I don't think I will have the time or patience for it.
I may start it, but my guess is, it will never get finished. IceChat 7 has taken well over 16 months to work on so far, and I am sure that Version 8 will take just as long, or even longer. That means it won't be ready until 2008 some time, and I just do not see that kind of commitment from myself. So if this program does not work, its not a big deal, as there are plenty of other free IRC Clients available to you.

Thanks for your time.
The IceChat God